Mixed and Mastered
Mixed and Mastered is the podcast where the untold stories of the music industry come to life. Hosted by Jeffrey Sledge, a veteran music executive and former VP of A&R at Atlantic Records and Jive Records, each episode dives deep into the journeys, challenges, and triumphs of the people shaping the sound of today. From label executives and producers to artists, songwriters, and managers, Jeffrey brings you behind the scenes to meet the minds driving the industry forward. There’s a gap in the marketplace for these voices, and Mixed and Mastered is here to fill it—one conversation at a time. Because the best stories are told by those who lived them.
Mixed and Mastered
Lisa Cambridge-Mitchell: Part 2
In Part 2 of our conversation with Lisa Cambridge-Mitchell, we follow her journey from LaFace Records—where she went from publicity to marketing and helped launch Usher’s My Way—through the politics of Arista, HBO’s digital experiment, and Jive Records. She shares raw stories of industry clashes, the reality of being paid not to work during her most lucrative years, and the constant challenges of being a Black woman executive in a business built on loyalty and power plays. Along the way, Lisa gives us a front-row seat to artist development at its highest stakes, from guiding a teenage Chris Brown to shaping how international audiences experienced some of the biggest names in R&B.
Lisa also opens up about her transition into coaching and why mentorship alone won’t sustain the next generation of creatives. For her, true patronage—the intentional act of surrounding emerging talent with the support they need to succeed—is what built her own career and what’s missing in today’s music and media landscape. It’s a conversation that mixes career highs and industry politics with timeless lessons on leadership, resilience, and the future of creative communities.
This is Mixed and Mastered with Lisa Cambridge-Mitchell.
Mixed and Mastered is produced and distributed by Merrick Studio, and hosted by music industry veteran, Jeffrey Sledge. Tune in to the discussion on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you catch your podcasts. Follow us on Instagram @MixedandMasteredPod to join the conversation and support the show at https://mixedandmasteredpod.buzzsprout.com/
Last week on Mixed and Mastered.
Speaker 2:I was in Hawaii and he had a show and I reached out to see if we could get tickets and this is like a ballroom, it's like at the Hilton Ballroom, it's not like a real venue. So we're like in the VIP area. He comes over, he meets my entire family, he gushes over my grandmother. It's just absolutely lovely. And then the next day I took my mom and my niece were swimming with the dolphins and he was there with his much younger girlfriend who I think they were together until he passed. And he's got like this is, you know, we've not, this is pre video phone, so he's got like the big camcorder and he's recording her with the dolphins and he's like Lisa, you know.
Speaker 2:So Tony Bennett was mine for my family. They were just like, wow, like okay, tony Bennett like, knows you and takes care of you.
Speaker 3:Welcome to Mixed and Mastered, a podcast where the stories of the music industry come to life. I'm Jeffrey Sledge, bringing you real conversations with the people who have shaped the sound of music. We're pulling back the curtain on what it takes to make it in the music business. These are the stories you won't hear anywhere else, told by the people who live them. This is Mixed and Mastered. Now for part two of Lisa Cambridge Mitchell on Mixed and Mastered.
Speaker 2:I was at LaFace for six years. You were there for six years, I was.
Speaker 2:I was there until they shut down and we're moving on to take over Arista and LA was really mad at me because LA was not big on people leaving. He was very loyal and he expected loyalty from people. And I didn't want to work at Arista for a number of reasons. One of the big ones was we had we had so much autonomy at LaFace so I was booking everything. I was booking the Grammys, I was booking the BET awards, I was booking you know, I at some point my I became head of marketing. While I was there, I started out as director of publicity and then I became a product manager.
Speaker 2:Um, and it was funny because DeVette again, devette was torturing me and there was like a big scandal that happened at the time and, um, she literally refused to come back to work. She was just like I always imagined her like fainting on the couch Like her, her, her assistant was sleeping with somebody she shouldn't have been sleeping with and she just never came back to work, like that was it. So LA had kind of wanted he had given me a lot of autonomy. I was. I was the only person like I was a product manager. When I, when I became a product manager, I no longer reported to to her, which was odd because all the product managers reported to her. So what they did was they gave me international um, because international at that time was publicity based.
Speaker 2:So it was natural that it was an extension of my job as as the head of publicity and then, um, eventually that kind of led to me moving towards marketing.
Speaker 2:So, so the first, the first artist that I, the first album that I marketed, was ushers my way album and that was like my first, like this is mine from a marketing standpoint, and I transitioned out of publicity. And then eventually I took over the department and I had I used to joke that I was the silent E on my face because basically, you know, video, like everybody reported to me, like video production didn't report me because Billy was there and he was amazing, um, but publicity reported to me. I led all the budget. You know, I had control over all the budgets. I was like, you know, if you didn't have me you couldn't happen. And LA and I had a relationship that I really appreciated because and it was always a little fraught because we'd be in a meeting and somebody would have an idea and he would be like that's a great idea, that's cool, Like oh yeah, wow, I love that.
Speaker 2:And then as he walked out of the room he would just like look at me and I would be like we're not doing that, like I would know, like we had such a a great. We were so symbiotic. It was really a great. It was such a great experience working with someone like that. And so I became the person that did all of our international, all those big international meetings. Um, I used to do all the presentations for that, because he didn't really like doing that stuff, like he liked to a point, but he just didn't want to always have to go to present to BMG overseas. And then the head of HR at BMG at the time, iris Allen, really liked me so he put me in a lot of the advancement programs. So I got to do a lot of training and just I was really supported. I was really, really supportive.
Speaker 2:So when they started talking about me going to Arista, I was going to be in the black music department. I was no longer going to book Grammys, I was no longer going to book MTV, I was no longer going to book like it was like, basically I was going to be reduced, yeah, but it was a step backwards, ported to. So I was just like, um, I think I'm going to leave, and LA was mad at me. He was really mad at me, um, but you know he was fine and I, um, I ended up going to, um, hbo. This was before the time Warner merger. Hbo is trying to be in the digital space on the urban side, and they started volumecom and so we were like, no, that's not. No, that was Kevin Dowdell.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, like uh, he was a corporate guy but he hired like the best of the best. It was like Riggs Morales was over there. I was there. Um, Dave Watkins was the one that brought me in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, dave walk, and then we had like veronica webb was writing for us and we had like a really great like we were. We were like we were like two weeks ahead of the curve, you know what I mean like we weren't that far ahead. But then when they did the time when time warner and aol which that tells you how old I am and when aol and time warner merged, they got rid of it because it was like, well, yeah, they deaded it and it was unfortunate because it was almost like I mean we just had an incredible staff, like it was, and I also made lifelong friends. I mean, one of my friends is my son's godmother. Another friend was just at my house two weeks ago for you know, a couple of weeks Like like we're all, like I built some really great relationships through there, um, but but we had people that had worked at Children's Television Network, we had people that had worked on Sesame Street, we had people that came out of LA that had worked with Cosby.
Speaker 2:Everybody was just so energized and excited. So it was really sad that it didn't come together because they put a lot behind it. So I was there for a very short time, but I was glad to be back in New York, because the whole time I was in Atlanta I was like I want to go back to New York. And then I, I took a package and I went and I, I, so they they folded. I took a package and LA was like hey, you know, we're starting new America with Kenny and I really, you know, I want you back over there.
Speaker 3:Like Kenny needs help, and so I agreed to go. That's baby face. Kenny is baby. Yeah, baby yeah, sorry yeah.
Speaker 2:Baby, yeah, no, no, no. Okay, I've always called face to Kenny, yeah, so he was like he really needs help, he needs somebody who knows how to structure it, and you would be working with our staff. Basically, we were more of an A&R company than anything else. And he also brought in Andre, and Andre had a when you work, know when somebody, when you work with somebody, when you're when you're really young and they don't realize that you've grown up, right.
Speaker 2:So he was still dealing with me, like it was you know exactly and I'm not that person anymore and I have the same. You know, I have relationships with people who you have relationships with, and so we really butted heads and what they did I was. It was really unfortunate, because I do, even to this day, I feel like it was a little bit of a setup. They wanted, they didn't want, andre had just come off of Uptown where he was like spending money like a drunken soldier or a drunken sailor, and so they didn't want him to get into that trap. So I was, I was intended to be the person who was, you know, the stopgap for spending, and so we were. I didn't report to him, we were co-equals and he just didn't like it. He just didn't like it. And I remember, you know and this is not to shade face, baby face in any way, because I love him and he was amazing and working with him was he's just incredible but I remember baby face. I was three months into my three-year deal and baby face called me to the studio and he was like well, lisa, you know, you know that Andre can't work with women, and that was like it was so hard. But I mean, I knew that it was true, but it was so hard, right, and he was like you know, andre can't work with women and this isn't going to like, this just isn't going to work.
Speaker 2:And I was like, okay, and then he wanted me to be, um, his kind of like his manager assistant. And basically they started telling me about, you know. I was like well, you'd come to my house and you'd pack my bags and you'd make sure. I was like yeah, yeah, that was pretty much my response. So when, um, I got a call from uh, I'll never forget this I got a call from Clement Williams, who is the head of like Clement, I think, used to work at the FBI or the CIA or something and he was head of HR at BMG.
Speaker 2:And Clement was like, like you are scared if you heard from Clement, because he was like no freaking joke. And he called me and he was like, hey, so you know, you're only three months into your deal. Uh, we're going to give you 10 cents on the dollar for the rest of, you know, for the remainder of your deal. And I was like, okay, so I just want to ask a question. So when they told me that I was being let go because Andre couldn't work with women. What should I do with that information?
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 2:And he said and I didn't even like. I was like what do I do with that? Like what do I do with that? And I remember he took a deep breath inside and he was like, did he say that to you? I said absolutely. And he said okay, uh, I'll call you back. I never heard from Clement again. I just got the separation agreement that they were going to pay me my three years. Full.
Speaker 2:So full. So for three years I was making more money. I was. I was making way more money than I had ever made in my entire career and I wasn't working. Now, in theory, that's amazing, right, but if that messes with your head, you know, because I was no longer. I had been Lisa from the face, I had been Lisa from uptown, I had been Lisa, and now I'm just like at home.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Getting a big ass.
Speaker 3:But you're not doing anything.
Speaker 2:I'm not doing anything and I'm not in the, I'm not in the community in the same way, and it was really hard, it was a really I always like I struggled with that. So for three years I was at home just because I they were like well, if you go back to work, basically they were going to.
Speaker 3:If I took a job, the money cuts off. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right so and I just didn't. There weren't any jobs. You know, I remember when I got promoted to vice president, when when Dorsey at that point I was, was when dorsey james was at, when I was at la face, he provoked for me from director level, vice president level. He called me in his office. He was really excited because he had lobbied for me and he was just like lisa, I'm really excited to tell you we're promoting you and I burst into tears and he was like and dorsey was a very like, he was just, he was like a, he was like half like a big brother kind of dad type personality.
Speaker 2:So I burst into tears. And he was just like what is? Happening, yeah, and I said you're making me unemployable, right, because how many VPs were?
Speaker 3:there yeah, not many.
Speaker 2:In Black music right. So I was like you just made me unemployable?
Speaker 3:Yeah, not many.
Speaker 2:So um, so I was home, I wasn't working, and then Marissa Menture and I you know Marissa, she was yeah, so Marissa and I were friendly, she was good friends Marissa's best friend is one of my best friends and Marissa was at my house and I remember I said she was like how are you doing? And I was like you know what? I think I should go back to work. This is too comfortable. I need to go back to work. I'm living on 3rd Street. I have a 1,200 square foot apartment that I bought, I'm chilling.
Speaker 2:It was just the right moment that Marissa was just like wait, are you serious? Because Jive is looking for somebody. By that point, there had been so many mergers. All my artists from Luthien.
Speaker 3:That went to Jive.
Speaker 2:And they hated it. Hold on one second.
Speaker 3:Give me two seconds um. Thank you sorry.
Speaker 2:no worries, you came to the job because I was there yeah, you were there and all my artists were there and they were really unhappy because it wasn't the same. It wasn't very different in the face yep, exactly, and so they immediately had somebody who could walk in. That was very different than the face Yep, exactly, and so they immediately had somebody who could walk in and talk to all of those artists.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I could talk.
Speaker 2:Like I could walk in and deal with Barry but I could deal with Usher. Yeah, exactly that. I had the relationships, which was great timing for me. I mean it was a step back in terms of title and pay and stuff like that, but it was like I had been employed for three years, so it made sense that it was a step back.
Speaker 2:And um, going there was, was it felt very. It felt like that was wow, I really worked hard to get like I, I it really made me appreciate all of the success that I had been a part of up until that point in my career because, you know, walking in the door, I knew I knew my shit. I knew the artists, I knew how to deal with them. I knew how to deal with the managers. Everybody was like you know, so it was I liked that. I really I enjoyed that transition. Um, and Jive was just Jive was just like bizarre to me. I mean, the whole time I was a job, I was like I just never forget the label meeting, my first label meeting, and you know the meeting's supposed to be at two and we go in the conference room and it's five and there's no, there's no, yeah sitting around like our meetings.
Speaker 2:we were tight, Like LA LaFace was tight, we ran everything. Like we were like boom, boom, boom, everything. So I'm like sitting there and I'll never forget. I went to Larry Kahn's office. I was like I don't know. I went to Tom Caraba's office and I was like this is something you should have mentioned in the interview. Like you like, so every wednesday I'm just like a hostage until like, and so that was. I had a really hard time with that because it felt so disrespectful and so, um, entitled like we.
Speaker 2:You know, it was like until I'm ready right, and when you think about the capital, the, the, the business capital and the, the financial capital of all of those people who are making a lot of money sitting around waiting, I was, I was so doing nothing, just not working. I was so offended Like I struggled with that for years. I was just like you cannot be serious, um, but you know, but I think you know, my job was interesting for me because jive showed me I hate to say this out loud, but Jive showed me that I was never going to get to where I wanted to be in the industry. Right, because I really my, I think my my general aspirations and this was why I took the New America job at the time. Aside from it being Kenny, being baby face, I really wanted to be a GM babyface. I really wanted to be a GM and I wanted to be a GM for, you know, we had all of these like when you and I came up.
Speaker 2:We had all these boutique labels, you know, like in lifestyle, and I wanted to be a GM for the next generation of them, right? So we had been talking, when I was at LaFace, we were doing a deal, we were trying to do a deal for um, you know, with organized noise, for red clay, and we had been talking about being a GM and it didn't work out. It was fine but but it was like I really felt like you know, I had. I'm one of the few executives and I say this proudly, I'm one of the few executives who've pretty much worked in every department. I have worked, you know.
Speaker 2:I have done promotion, I have done international, I've done marketing, I've run marketing. I, you know, I've had creative services report to me. I've had video production report to me. I've had publicity report to me, like I have done. There is not an area of the music business, when I was in it, that I had not had significant experiences that I could not speak about with authority, right, because I, you know I'd done in promotion, I'd done retail, you know, and then in our in we three, if you needed help, like if Vanessa had to make calls and she didn't have enough time.
Speaker 2:I was on the phone doing college promo like radio promo. So I was really. I was always, I feel, like I was really good at my job because I understood what everybody else had to do. I was never, I never. They never had to educate and explain what they needed from me, and I think that my peers really appreciated that. And then in turn, I was also able to. When my artists were complaining, I was able to explain to them what was actually going on and what we actually needed to do and why it was important.
Speaker 2:Right and I wanted my, my professional goals were to be not I didn't want to be like a GM at like a dive. I wanted to be a GM at like that, that little boutique label that was as impactful as the ones that I had worked for.
Speaker 2:And those really didn't exist, um, anymore that that, um, you know all that money. I used to say that like people used to be like, oh, the music industry is shrinking. I said, of course it is Because you know if the white man in charge of the labels and you know at the distribution level and at the, you know at the highest levels, if they're not making money they're not going to let you make money Exactly.
Speaker 2:Right. So that was really hard. And I remember I just at Jive especially, like I could never get anywhere at that company and I remember going to Tom Carraba and being like, listen, like you got to do more for me, Like I'm way too experienced to be like so, Tom, I give Tom credit. Tom was the one that promoted me to SVP, but he gave me the money first. He was like, listen, I can give you the money before I can get you the title. And I always that always stuck with me Like that's so messed up, Right. Like he was like, oh, I'll get you the money. So if you're willing to take the money, the SVP money, and I promise I will work on getting you the title on the next round, you know, of promotions. And so that was what he did and he stood. He stood true to his word. He was the one that promoted me.
Speaker 2:And after, with all the mergers I don't even remember all the mergers that happened I never ran a department again. Like I ran, I had 50 people on my staff at LaFace. I never had more than maybe six or seven people on my staff after I left Well, LaFace, and even at HBO I had like 56 people or something like that.
Speaker 2:So I always felt really stunted and because I felt like the artists that I had, the artists that I worked with, were so exceptional I wasn't really interested in going someplace else, right, and I wasn't really interested, like I wasn't interested in courting another label to try to, like you know, advance my career that way again, because I wanted to work with those people that, like, had a perspective and had, you know, like I remember, do you remember little mama? So I always, like I always use this as an example, like and this goes back to growing up on the Upper West Side.
Speaker 2:to be honest, Little mama's dad, True, was batshit crazy.
Speaker 2:True was insane and True, and I adored each other, adored each other, right, and one of the reasons, one of the ways that we bonded, was we were in a big label meeting. There were all these people in the meeting. It was more like junior work meeting. There were all these people in the meeting and I was watching true and he was getting offended and I was like, hey, you guys can we just take a break? I need a minute with true. And I pulled them aside, I pulled in my office, we went to my office and he was like he was like true was like a pit bull, like he was like you know, and and I was like um, true, I just want to make something perfectly clear to you. You can't punch anybody in the face. This is not that situation. They will have you arrested, you will have problems. You cannot come up here and think you got to play pizza.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, thugging it out, and I remember he wanted I could see him. Ian Steven was talking and I could see him looking at Ian and like tensing, and I was like, and Ian wasn't even like, ian was just being.
Speaker 2:Ian and being honest and kind of you know, um, but like that, as silly as that may sound, that was my sweet spot. Like somebody like that, like I could use my education and my presentation and my ability to show up and make everybody comfortable and talk to you know, the white, the white leadership that had no, they didn't even know any black people. That didn't work for them, um, and I could also talk to true and be like and be like like what the fuck are you?
Speaker 2:doing and he used to be like and I remember in that conversation he was like that's why I fucks with you. That's why I fucks with you all right, I ain't gonna hurt nobody. I was like and don't come up here with it, because he was carrying. And I saw that he was carrying and nobody else saw that shit. And I'm like don't come up here with a gun again, please.
Speaker 3:And he was like I'm like not dead ass, like you got to chill.
Speaker 2:Yeah, dead ass. Like you can't, like, you can't, like, you can't do that Like he's got it.
Speaker 2:You said to true, I beat, we had a true and I had an agreement that I was like, if something comes up that you don't understand, you come look for me. And he came to me a couple of times like, yo, what the fuck was that? I'm like okay, this is what that was. This is how international works. This is why we can't do this. This is why we couldn't give you money for that Um, and I have that ability to make people feel comfortable, um, comfortable while also running business. So it was always frustrating to me that I didn't kind of take my career as far as I want. I remember when Jeff Jotis, who had been doing digital, was promoted over me and became my boss, he put me in his office and he was like I don't know why you report to me. You should not report to me. I don't even know what to say, but I will not get in your way.
Speaker 1:And we'll be right back Ready to launch your podcast. Merrick Studios offers comprehensive services, from concept development and seamless production to strategic marketing and monetization. Let your story take the mic. Visit MerrickCreativecom slash studios and let's get to work.
Speaker 4:Master the art of lyricism with Pendulum Inc. The first school for rap. Learn elite techniques through immersive lessons, real-world exercises and guidance from hip-hop icons. This is where MCs sharpen their skills and glow boldly on the mic. Ready to level up, visit PendulumInccom and start your journey today. And now back to our show.
Speaker 3:I like Jeff Doe, I didn't read him well at first but once I got to know him, a little bit. I was like nah, I fucks with you, jeff. He was cool, he was cool.
Speaker 2:And he lived. He only lives like he lives in Lewisboro, which is like 20 minutes from my house. I've never run into him or anything, but when we moved up here he was like super uncomfortable. I was like, oh, we moved to Richville. And he was like, oh my God, I'm going to run into you, I'm going to have to talk to you, I'm going to see you at the Target.
Speaker 3:You know Exactly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so he was really good.
Speaker 3:Before we move on to the next part, tell me I know there's many of them. Tell me, because what people don't understand is you know? You see Chris Brown now right, he's a superstar. I always tell people and it's very tight, he's probably this I always say 1A most talented artist I've ever been around. The most talented artist I've ever been around was R Kelly, just talent-wise. I'm not talking about talent-wise, the writing, the playing, the. I've seen R Kelly playing Nat King Cole songs, but Chris is right there, not as far as playing, but just being a true artist. He'd come up to the office, he'd have drawn some dope shit on his Timbs and he was just so artistic.
Speaker 2:He used to sleep in my office. He used to take naps in my office.
Speaker 3:He was like 15, 16. He was a child when he signed to Jive. He was a child, so we literally saw him grow up, literally Right.
Speaker 2:My son is 15.
Speaker 3:It freaks me out, I'm always like Usher was 12 when I met him and chris was 15 and I'm a kid, so and I was just, you know, then rihanna thing happened and you know, things kind of went crazy, um. But um, I'm glad to see him where he is now, because he is that level of talent to like to put out these records and do these massive shows, and even though they jerk him every year at the Grammys.
Speaker 2:But do you know, have you ever really thought about how he's been able to do that?
Speaker 3:I don't, I haven't figured it out.
Speaker 2:So this is the brilliance of Chris, and this is where Chris does not get enough credit. Chris was the last of the artists on the deals. He was the last artist that wasn't on a 360 right true, true true, right. So so he was just a straight sign whatever deal straight sign. So but when, if you remember, when we were working chris in the beginning, chris started making mix tapes and we were like we were like you are killing us.
Speaker 3:What are you?
Speaker 2:doing? What are you doing? Stop it. And the mix tapes remember his albums were all like you know. You had Yo and he had the dimples and the smile and he was like the perfect little kid, perfect teenager that you wanted your daughter to bring home. And then the mix tapes were like we're really him.
Speaker 3:That was him for real.
Speaker 2:And what Chris were like, really him, that was him for real, right. And what chris what chris was brilliant and it continues to be brilliant about what chris was at that time brilliant about was he understood that he had to go high and he had to go low, right, and that if he went high he could be on radio and if he went low he would have streets in the streets. In the streets, yes, in the streets, but he would have Chris's mom. I mean not Chris's mom, the mom would like yo and the daughter would like the gutter the mixtapes.
Speaker 2:Right, it was right at the beginning of mixtapes mattering that he started doing that. So that's one thing that I've always thought was really brilliant about chris, and you know to your point about him just being creative and being an artist, because chris chris could. Chris chris couldn't draw when we first signed him. Like he grew into this like amazing graffiti artist, right like he drew.
Speaker 4:It was like every other dude exactly, exactly, um, but the.
Speaker 2:So he did that. And then his work ethic it does. It never met. Like chris always wanted to be in the studio and that was actually one of the big challenges when we had the merger and we went to RCA, the biggest challenge that they had with Chris was that Chris wouldn't come to the office. I will never forget this.
Speaker 2:I went to see Chris. Tina was still managing him. I went to Chris and I was just like hey, they want to see you, they want some FaceTime with you. And he was like tell them to come to the studio. And I was like no, they want to do it. I think it was Grammys, the studio. And I was like no, they want to do it. It was, I think it was grammys or something. I was like they want to do it at the grammys. He was like so they don't actually want to get to know me. I was like chris, you got it. Like and he was like no, I don't know. And I had to like literally sit there and be like chris, can you do it for me? Like I need you to. Like this is these are my bosses, these are people that control your release schedule.
Speaker 2:Like money you have to say hi, yeah, he was like. Chris was like I don't need to talk to nobody, but you, I'm good. I was like no, you're not, you can't do that. So chris, chris's entire like whether he was having problems or doing whatever he was like, whatever was in insanity might be going on in his life. He would always be in the studio. He would always be recording and he was always pro artist and pro writer right, like chris, respected the writers.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I look at what chris did for seven streeter as a writer. Right, he understood, like chris. I don't, I don't know where it comes from, because Chris is not the kind of person who's just kind of like do something for no reason, like he's. He's very it's not that he's transactional, but he's very like deliberate. He's really stubborn. So if he decides he's going to do something, he's going to do it. If he decides he's not going to do it, he's not going to do it. But Chris always supported the song the writers and the producers.
Speaker 2:He always was out there caping for them and I think that's like the. What he's seeing now, what's happening in his career now, is an accumulation of being, you know, to your point. He's just undeniable he's absolutely undeniable.
Speaker 2:Did you see the meme thing that was going around last week? The woman that was like? She was like she was probably in her late 40s, like early 40s, late 30s, and she was at his show and she was nearly in tears because she was like he's been on stage for three hours and I got to go to work tomorrow and you can hear him playing in the background.
Speaker 3:You can hear him singing songs like in the background he's on stage and she's in like the lobby area and she's like. I paid 200 for this ticket. He's already done 400 worth of show. I gotta leave. I don't like. And that's chris, like you know what he didn't do one song still in those three hours.
Speaker 2:He had more shit he could have done.
Speaker 3:He just yeah more shit yeah and did you know that, chris?
Speaker 2:did you know that when we signed chris I will never forget this we a? Do you remember? We did that big showcase at planet Hollywood for everybody.
Speaker 2:It was like the first time, like we had signed him and a lot of people were like he, you know, like no one wanted to believe that he was going to be amazing. And I put him in rehearsal and I went by rehearsals and I was like hey, you know how's it going Like. And Chris was like he's like, oh, it's okay, you know. And he was using a headset mic and, um, I remember I said to him I was like chris, that that mic is not, it's not working like, all right, so what do you usually perform with? And he was like what do you mean? I'm like, well, what kind of mic do you usually use? He was like for what I'm like? And this is when you're talking to a 15-year-old right he's like for what I'm like.
Speaker 2:I think it's an easy question, like when you perform, what microphone do you like to use? And finally they clicked and he was like I've never performed before. I was like squeeze me, he's like I've never performed before. Yeah, chris did not come up like usher. When I'm at usher he had one car search. Like he was right, chris had never been on stage until we did that.
Speaker 3:Hollywood Virginia, he was just a kid from Virginia from.
Speaker 2:Tappahannock, virginia. I went to Tappahannock, by the way, different story, but but Chris like. So, chris, like his talent I mean we had, we were like we had millions of dollars invested in him. And I remember going back to the label meeting and being like did anybody know that chris brown has never been on a stage before? And everyone was like what, yeah, how did?
Speaker 2:no one know that yeah, they just everybody just figured like, of course he did talent shows. He had never done a talent show, he he had. It was wild. I have never experienced that before, I've never had that tell me about working at um at title uh, that didn't really work for me.
Speaker 2:So, in fairness, I have been in one ecosystem for so long. I have been in that beat sony, bmg, you know bmg, sony, eventually, ecosystem, and with the same group of people. So I didn't know the rock nation people, so I didn't really have a relationship with them.
Speaker 3:They're so cult, almost there's. It's cultish I don't know many yes and so and ty, ty like a little teeny bit and pretty much that's it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know any of them and uh des hired me, um, and I actually like I really really liked des, liked Des, but yo, she is frightening, right. So I remember when I when, as I was getting to know her, we, you know, we'd be in meetings and we could be in a meeting and everybody would have would be buttoned up Like we could talk about a project and I'd be like okay, this, this, I'm like okay, great. And then Des would walk in the room and she'd be like okay, tell me what's going on, and I would defer to the person who you know I would. I was very I've always been I'm. I don't believe that power should rest with me like I'm like, if you know we're in, we're working together, I'm gonna like give everybody the opportunity to shine. So I remember I turned to somebody who was like really dope at their job and I was like okay, so you should like explain to Des what we're doing, and they were like gross because everybody there was so afraid of her
Speaker 2:exactly. And then she would be. She would be so upset like then des would be upset because she would be like nothing's gotten done. And I'm like no, that's not true. Like these people are so scared of you. And she was just like looking at me like what are you talking about? Like why are they scaring me? I'm like I don't know, but they're scared of you. And she was just looking at me like what are you talking about? Why are they scared of me? I'm like I don't know, but they're scared of you. But when I got there, it was a couple of things. I got there at a time. Can we talk about me leaving RCA? So I left RCA, I was pissed, I was pissed, I was pissed.
Speaker 2:I was pissed because what basically happened was they hired someone to take over marketing who had never done marketing before and what the you know who that was, and what they did was the that person really was, and I had known that person for almost 20 years at that point and I was actually looking forward to working with them. And when they when they had known that person for almost 20 years at that point and I was actually looking forward to working with them and, um, when they, when they had him take over marketing what he did, he did things that were just grimy, like, for example, I wasn't allowed to book me, not just me, but like you're, like I'm, like an SVP and I'm not permitted to book conference rooms anymore. You had to go through his office so that he could decide if your meeting was something that he wanted to sit in on. Right, and he was using you know, I know what I'm being used Like you can't like, you know seriously, like, come on, um, he was, he really was trying to use the capital of other people's relationships to learn what the hell he was supposed to be doing and also to, um, to develop relationships, right. So I stopped having meetings in conference rooms. I did all my meetings in my office, right, and that made him pissed Like that, pissed him off. Pissed like that pissed him off. And then the other thing he used to do in meetings, which was like my favorite. This was like my favorite cat and mouse game.
Speaker 2:He would be in a meeting and it would be like, hey, so we're gonna, you know, we'd have this big release coming up and we'd start talking about it and he would, basically they would turn to him as the, you know, head of marketing and they'd be like, what are we gonna do? And he would say, hey, yeah, you know, I've been in some conversations I'm going to use myself as an example but there was more than just me involved. He would say, well, you know, we're trying to, we're trying to narrow it down. And so, lisa, you know, here are the things that, like the things that we were concerned about, would come up in the conversation. And then he would turn to me and be like so, lisa, for that project, like what are you thinking? And at first I was not totally paying attention and I would be like, well, I think, blah, blah, blah, we should do this approach, we should do that strategy. And then one day I was like this is what he's using.
Speaker 3:He don't know what he's talking about, so he's like you don't know what he's talking about.
Speaker 2:Right, right. So what I started doing was he and be like so what are you thinking? And I'd say, you know I need to kind of let me this is the first time I'm really hearing this. Let me digest it a bit while. Why don't you go ahead and you, you take the lead and let us let him and I remember that look on his face. The first time I did that he was like this bitch like and so, and so our relationship, it deteriorated very rapidly.
Speaker 2:I would have my artists and managers loved me, like they loved, like we had great relationships with them. So they would come up to the office, they'd say hi, they'd play records, we'd have lunch, like we just. But I'm also very much a person with boundaries. I am real clear that my personal life is my personal life. Like I'm not that person. And we I remember we had Tinasasha and her manager came up to see me. She was in between records, in between singles, I think, and she came out there. The management management came to see me and they were really excited about some records and he played them for me and I was like, oh, that was great. We were chatting. We were like, well, what about this, what about that? And what do you think about timing? And we're just like we were meeting, but really we were just hanging out because we had a good relationship.
Speaker 2:And after they left, like the next day he comes out my office and he was like, why didn't you call me into the tenante meeting? And I was like, cause it wasn't a meeting, they stopped at my office. And he was just like you know, in the future, when you have a meeting with any manager, any artists, I need to be informed so that I can decide if I'm going to be there. And I was just like, okay, okay, okay. And the final straw is I will never forget this Like we had an issue, chris, cause you remember, chris, he just put records out and we'd be like, oh God, right.
Speaker 2:So Chris just like put a record out and I was chasing it down to get it at iTunes and Spotify and everything. And we did, we, we, and everything. We got it. It was live. Art was there, all the things were there. He called me, not Chris, the other person he called me and he said, hey, so international. So there's a problem with how you handled the Chris Brown release. I was just like okay, and he said you know it has been said.
Speaker 2:It has been said I'm like been said it has been said, because I'm like who said it? Who, who, who is they and what? Get them on the phone. So he's like well, it's been said that you did xyz and you should have done it this way. And I was just like, but that's not how it works, that's not because at the time, like apple hat was very strict at that time and so you could get up to spotify within 24 hours, but apple was just a couple of days and you know, it was just like the quality control it was always like a thing. And he was just like well, it should have gone up everywhere at once and I was like that was not a possibility because Chris put the record out.
Speaker 2:You know, that was not never. That's not how it works. And I said, okay, you need to put whoever has this issue on the phone with me, because I don't know, I don't do that, I don't play games. I was like I don't play games. If I have a problem with somebody, you know, for better or worse I come straight at you. So I was just like okay, you know. So he puts me on the phone. He calls Monica I love Monica. He calls Monica Cornea and a couple other people.
Speaker 2:She actually he called her and she was in someone else's office who worked in sales, and they put it on speaker and and I sat quietly cause I knew I wasn't wrong, and he was like yeah, so I'm talking to Lisa and I'm telling her that you know this, she should have done this and I need you to really like you know blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And he like just talked himself into a corner and they were like that's not how it works and that's not what we said. We said that we wish that Chris hadn't done this so that we could get the record up properly. But what, lisa?
Speaker 3:did the only thing that we could do was. That's not how it works.
Speaker 2:Right and he was pissed because I didn't say anything. I just sat and listened and said nothing and he was pissed. So fast forward. We're moving into the new building and I was, uh, standing at caroline williams office. We were, I was in her doorway talking to her and I saw the head. I saw amory weiss walk by and hr had already left the building. We were the lab.
Speaker 3:I don't know you weren't there.
Speaker 2:We were the last. We were the last company to move into the building because, basically, tom corson was like y'all are not gonna have us be guinea pigs. We got too many things going on, so we want to move last. Well, after you guys figured out the internet and figured out all the shit, that's not gonna work. So, um, I was standing carolyn's office in amory, walk by, and I remember thinking like why is she here? Right, because I knew they'd already moved. And then my assistant came over and was just like I had left my phone in my office. My assistant was like I've been looking for you. You know he wants you in his office. And I was like I turned to Carolyn and I said I think I'm going to get laid off today and she looked at me with like horror because it meant that she would have gotten all my projects Right. So she was just like what? Like I can't take all your. I was like. She was like don't even play, I'm like all right, let me see how it goes. So I've I have always felt this was my finest hour.
Speaker 2:I walked in the office and HR was there. The person that was the head of marketing there was there, and I think that was it. I mean, I've been one other person, I don't remember and I walked in and I stood at the door and I was like oh, okay, am I going to be working here when this conversation is over? And he said can you just come in and sit down? I was like no, no, no, no, no, I cannot. Am I going to be working here when this conversation is over? Will I continue? Will I still be employed here? And he said well, you know, we're making some changes. And I was just like okay, the answer is changes. And I was just like okay, the answer is no. And he was like and you could just see man because we had already fired her Like I want to.
Speaker 2:I wouldn't know. So he was like well, he was like well, he just was like so exasperated. He was like, well, no, you're not. Was like okay, then I don't need to speak to you. What are we talking? She needs to speak with my attorney.
Speaker 3:He's like well, can you just?
Speaker 2:yeah. He was like, well, can you come in? I was like no, and I didn't even close his door.
Speaker 2:I was like no, no, I can't, I, there's nothing for us to talk about, and part of where that came from was he took me to lunch. I'll never forget this. He took me to lunch and he said you know, lisa, he took me to lunch and he said you know, lisa, this might not work out. And I'm like I am not the one. So I was like, um, I agree, I will let you know how I feel about it. And from that point, like he was just undone and I had documented everything I have, like I had gone to HR about it, I had gone to Tom Corson, I got to everybody about it, I documented it all. I had, like you know, a running diary, everything was going on.
Speaker 2:Like really just inappropriate. Yeah, and what they did was because his role didn't exist. What they did was they pulled down from the GM, right, so he got, he took on a lot of like Corson stuff and then they pulled up from the SVPs. So I used to sit in the like Sony worldwide planning meetings and have like a landscape. I understood the landscape of globally, what we were doing.
Speaker 2:Suddenly, I'm not in those meetings anymore and I was pissed because I was just like so I'm just a product manager, I happen to be an SVP, but I'm just like you have reduced me to a product manager who cannot book a conference room, like no, no. And so I was really bitter, really really bitter. Um, and I got, uh, I got a great package. There was no, you know, they didn't play with my money. I got my bonus, um, but they did try to. Um, they tried to tell Mark Pitts I'll never forget Mark. Mark was pissed and they tried to tell Mark that they were like well, you know you need to understand that he had a tough decision to make. He had to. He had to choose between Carolyn and Lisa, and so you know Mark is loyal and I've known Mark since Uptown, so you know, mark was, when he was managing Biggie, like I knew him from then when Biggie was on Uptown.
Speaker 2:So Mark was immediately ready to like go to fight for me and I was like listen, don't let them trick you. I said the problem is they have to pay for him now. I said they need my money. This has nothing to do with a tough decision between me and Carolyn, don't let them lie to you. That has nothing to do with it. They created a position that they didn't have the money for and now they need my salary, right. And they they let they laid off. Like, if you do the math, they laid off that day they laid off me and one other person and that was about the right number, right. So I was like don't, don't let them bamboozle. You Like it's just you, you support Carolyn, cause he wasn't. He wasn't like Carolyn.
Speaker 3:We weren't, like we weren't, I wouldn't call us friends.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were always on the same side, we always saw what was happening, Um, and that was really disheartening and it kind of like you know I remember talking to. I ran into Sylvia Rohn once at the beach in a vineyard, and I was like you know, Sylvia, I said I got to tell you, as much as I want to like sell in this business, I'm not willing to sacrifice what you sacrificed. I want a family.
Speaker 2:I want to you know, there are all these things that I want for my life. And Sylvia was like it was so amazing Cause she got real quiet, no-transcript. It was literally like working. It was like the nineties, like people would call you and scream on you and I was like this is not 1991. You are not going to talk to me like that. It was also one of the things that was really interesting about working at title at that time. One of the things that was really interesting about working a title at that time was there was this kind of like in, like this influx, but they were really working with um. I can't, uh, what is his name? I can't think of his name. He's a Dominican artist, um, actually Usher did a record with him, um, and so there were this.
Speaker 2:There was this like kind of Dominican artists, latin artists that they were cultivating and it was really awkward because I grew up in a Dominican neighborhood, so I understood everybody, I understood what they were trying to do and I understood the culture, but I don't speak Spanish so I was always kind of not really able to be part of those conversations because they would eventually you know, flip it into Spanish and I would just be like fuck.
Speaker 2:So that that was hard. And then I got sick, um, I have lupus, and I ended up, um, I was on my way home and I ended up having like a a little health crisis and was, you know, in the hospital I actually resigned from title from the hospital.
Speaker 2:Um, because I was, because I didn't know them. If I had been at sony, you know, or rca, when I got sick, I would have just taken a leave and you know. But I didn't know the title people and I didn't. I didn't enjoy being there, like it felt. It just was so, like, not that it was toxic, but it was just so like, not that it was toxic, but it was just so like nobody trusted anybody.
Speaker 2:Everybody's like screaming on people and the team was great. It was an amazing group of people there. They went on to do some really great things with Tidal and Tidal I don't know if you've ever really used it.
Speaker 3:The sound quality of Tidal is like it's for autofiles. Yeah, it sounds way better than everything else.
Speaker 2:It's way better than everything else. Um, but I just I wasn't in a place where I could ask them to understand because I did not know them.
Speaker 3:I didn't know them at all. Persistent joy, persistent joy. Tell me about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, persistent joy. So I started when I left and I was sick for I was probably sick for about two years after I left Idol and I really I started thinking about what I wanted to do next and one of the things that what I loved about my job always was artist development. I loved being able to sit down and talk to an artist and have someone come in. You know I would say like I loved, you know, you know, have pink come in the door and she's in a group and the group is really not very good and she's trying to figure out who she wants to be and you know, connecting her with David Myers. And you know, like I, like I loved that part in addition to just the logistics, like I love logistics. I love a plan.
Speaker 2:I love executing a plan, but the biggest thing I saw was I said, well, I want to continue to support creatives. And at the time, like now, 10 years later, which is crazy, coaching is so kind of. I mean, first of all, you have people that are just like I give good advice, I'm a coach. That's not what it is. I went and I got my training and I understand the modality of coaching and what coaching really does more than anything else is it says okay, what do we do from this point forward? It doesn't really look at the past except for information, right? So that's the probably biggest thing is we say, okay, what do you want to do now? And holding people accountable and getting them to to, um, get rid of their, their blocks.
Speaker 2:And I, I it. It spoke to me. I kept saying to people I was like I want to help artists and I didn't realize at the time when I was saying that that I was describing coaching. Um, and, having gone to UVA, our alumni association does these like career development programs every once in a while, and I was on this call and I was just like you know, a little bit like I don't know what I'm gonna do with myself, because I couldn't, you know, we live an hour and a half from the city. I couldn't, I can't you know help you every day yeah, I can't.
Speaker 2:I there's, I have a lot of like I I have to rest, like I'm a person, I now you know whatever um, but I kept saying it to people.
Speaker 2:And then I went to this, like I did this webinar, and there was this woman and she was talking about coaching and I was like, holy shit, that's what I've been saying to people, that's what I've been trying to describe. So I ended up, um, and I'm not woo woo, so I didn't want to do the like you know we're going to talk about your aura Like I wanted to actually have it based in science, based in um, in helping people in a way that was, you know, do no harm and helping, you know, like I just wanted to help, like I just I'm a helper and that's what I wanted. And, um, I did my training and then I just started putting it out there that I was coaching and I ironically, I have only done a couple of things in the music business, like I usually there I did like a seminar, I mean a webinar for um, universal music that Toya Summers, um connected me with them, and I did like a you know.
Speaker 2:I had like 500 people on a call or something crazy, um, but most of my clientele are filmmakers and storytellers, and so I work with, which isn't really that much different, honestly, um, but I work with. I primarily work with women, mostly women of color, Um, and I work with a lot of fellowships. This current climate is a little hard because a lot of the funding for the programs that I would work with are they were diversity based.
Speaker 2:So they're being attacked. But I've done work with the Canadian Academy, which is like their version of the Oscars. I've worked with indigenous indigenous filmmakers and editors and storytellers through them, which I loved. I've worked with the center for Asian American media, which was such a learning lesson. Like you know, I'm um my grandparents were immigrants, so I'm second generation and I was like you know, initially, when I started pitching business to to the center for Asian American media, I was like they're never going to hire me, like this black woman, like they're going to be like you don't get us and then was like they're never gonna hire me, like this black one, like they're gonna be like you don't get us.
Speaker 2:And then I found that the conversations were the same. You know, they were like, yeah, the same conversations. So, yeah, so I've been doing that and I'm in the process of kind of pivoting it. I I think what I would like my platform to develop into over the next, you know, the next phase of my company and my career, is making this movement from from like mentorship. I feel like we've done a really good job at mentoring. I think that the, the, the creative community, the black creative community, the community of color we mentor we do a really good job of mentoring, what I don't think we do.
Speaker 2:I think we are in a time right now, particularly with the current climate, where we need to move to a patronage model, meaning like putting people in place to succeed, not just being there to help them when they're succeeding, but actually like doing, because that's what the white boys do they decide. You know, I look at my experience at RCA. They decided that he was going to be the leader and they surrounded him with everything that he needed to take that role. That's what patronage looks like. That's not mentoring. That's what patronage looks like.
Speaker 2:So I don't know what that practically means for me, what that practically means for me, but I feel like with every bone in my body I know that patronage was what made my career successful. It was Andre, you know, with all of the flaws of working at all the crazy shit, it was Andre looking at me and saying you're groomed for greatness, you should be a publicist. And I'm like, okay, I'll give it a shot. Right, it was LA being like hey, you know what? You're really good as a publicist, but I think you would. But I see that the corporate guys really gravitate to you, you know cause they were all Germans.
Speaker 2:My mother worked for German airline, all of her, her professional people. So, I could talk to the Germans and I could read German. I could read German, so I would get like I would, I would. They would get like memo, you know. Something would go around and it was in German and be like, oh, we forgot to translate, and I'd be like, no, I can read it, you know. So they liked me, um and it. It was all patronage Like if you think about, even if you think about your own success.
Speaker 2:there was some point where somebody just saw something in you and they became your patron, right, and I don't think that we as a as specifically as a black community, in entertainment and in, I would argue, in music, but even in politics, everything, I don't think that we tap into patronage enough. I think that we feel that, you know well, you know they've got to pull themselves up and they got to do and they got to prove, and then I'll help them, right, because we're so conditioned to think that we have to be, you know, twice as good as everybody, which we do, right, but but there is also that place where we can decide that someone's going to be our next leader.
Speaker 2:That's what happened with Obama. I, like I've always shared that um, I've shared this story many times with people that obama's success was almost the result of. I mean, there was patronage, but he went to. He came to new york I'll never forget this. Uh, my mom again, everybody. She moved to political circles. He came to new york to kiss the ring for all of the black politicians to say I want to run for president and they told him not to those all, all those like Charlie.
Speaker 2:Rangles. Hillary and all that, David Jenkins. All that they told him, it wasn't his turn. Do you know who they told him? Do you know? Did you ever know, like who? They said whose turn it was? David Patterson, who's on to David Patterson? Right, it was one of his governors and they were like no, so it's his turn exactly it's his turn, because they never believed that they could elect a president.
Speaker 2:So they were trying to put people, they were trying to amass power, but they never believed in a black president, and I've always felt really strongly that what the the? The beauty of Barack Obama being elected and I went to a couple of fundraisers for him the beauty of it was that he always knew he could be president and the people that supported him knew that he could be president and so he didn't need those other people.
Speaker 3:In my opinion, that's what's happening now with Mondami in New York. He didn't go through those people the usual preachers and politicians and all those guys but he didn't go through any of those guys and him and his crew Che Osei Reggie's son and his crew, che Osei Reggie's son and his crew they're like, nah, he could be the mayor, he could be the mayor he's not kissing the rings and they're like that's where they're pissed, because they're like if he gets in, he don't owe us no favors.
Speaker 3:He's not beholden, so now, what are you going? To do that's right. He ain't got to come back. And's right, because you did this, I'm gonna do this. He don't have that on his back. So it's a very similar thing we're seeing, and I think we're gonna see that kind of repeat itself moving forward before we wrap up but that's what we did.
Speaker 2:But I just have to say that that's what we did in the music business in the 90s. That was patronage. Those boutique labels, those like the faces and the depth. They decided to put money in a place that they didn't understand necessarily and because they knew that there was an upside, I always I wanted. I was having this conversation with my son recently and I was like you have to understand that when I was in the music business, when I was starting my career, record labels and distribution labels sold little shiny discs. They didn't give a shit what was on them, they just sold little shiny discs. And the reason that the collapse of it was like and you think about the margin on a little shiny disc that cost like a dollar 25 to make. That was wholesale for 6.99, retail for sometimes 15, you know, from 9.99 to retail for sometimes $15, you know, from $9.99 to $15.
Speaker 2:I was like those margins were there when that became a file and you no longer controlled the medium. That was the demise of the music business. That's why you don't have artist development anymore. That's why you don't have, you know, breakthrough artists. That's why you have people chasing TikTok numbers, you know, and signing somebody based on SoundCloud and stuff like that, because you don't have the ability to have that patronage. You don't have, you know, TLC made out as possible.
Speaker 2:Right, you don't have that anymore because you don't have those margins. You don't have the money's not there anymore.
Speaker 2:But I do believe that that mindset in our community we've gotten. We got complacent because we thought that we were doing okay, Right. And this current climate made it a hundred percent clear we are not. We are vulnerable, Right. So I'm really, so I'm really interested in that commitment to patronage, in that commitment to creating vehicles for other people to succeed beyond mentorship, right when there's money on the table. So I don't know what that looks like.
Speaker 3:You're right, mentorship doesn't always mean cash. It means time.
Speaker 2:Mentorship means somebody you guys want to talk to.
Speaker 3:That's cool and that's valuable, but, like you said, if there's no cash behind it, it kind of runs its course pretty quickly. You know what I'm saying? It's kind of like eh yeah but I don't know. But my kind is jammed up and talking to this person over a cup of coffee is not really helping that. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Exactly Before we not really helping.
Speaker 3:that you know, I mean um, exactly before we wrap up, um two of your favorite artists oh, that's easy.
Speaker 2:My absolute, like every day that I miss, is miguel. I miss miguel. I love Miguel, um and um, my favorite artist to work with.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 2:Usher and my favorite artist is a person Okay, t-boz. Okay, I love that, I love me some T-Boz, but I always, I always struggled because I felt like I couldn't be a real friend to her because my role, but I always loved her. I felt like I couldn't be a real friend to her because my role, but I always loved her, she was she's just dope.
Speaker 3:Tell me cause you're about to experience it Um two of your favorite places in Martha's Vineyard.
Speaker 2:All right, let me see, I'm not going to get you.
Speaker 3:She might not say it because she don't want your niggas over there.
Speaker 2:Oh really, oh damn, I shouldn't have. All right, I'm not going to get you. Well, number one is my house. You know I'm a homebody, my house, I'm happy to be up in my house and, um, there's a restaurant called guard east that nobody goes to. This is like I should gatekeep it. That I want. Like a lot of people tend not to go there because they don't think there's parking, because where the restaurant is there's only like four parking spaces. But you actually park across the street and it's like right on the water and you can have oysters and drinks, and so that's become a place that we like to kind of post up and you know, it's basically like we're gonna be, there for like three, four hours just chilling, yeah, hanging out, um, and then my other one would be honestly any friend that's, that's what house porch like.
Speaker 3:It's just, it's the house, it's the house, yeah that's what it is, the house hopping.
Speaker 2:You know, it is it porch? It's the house hopping. Yeah, that's what it is, it's the house hopping?
Speaker 3:It is, it's the house hopping.
Speaker 2:It's the house hopping and there's a lot of politics to house hopping you don't just walk up on somebody's porch. You stand a respectable distance back until you are invited to ascend to the porch.
Speaker 3:You don't go and keep a towel on your head. You got to be invited or be with somebody invited and you get properly introduced and people are going to ask you where you went to school. They're going to ask you these things. Don't be offended, it just is what it is.
Speaker 2:And they're not going to ask you what you do. That's the nuance. They don't want to know what you do. They want to know where you came from and how you got here.
Speaker 3:You're doing something, so we don't really need to kind of figure that part out. We'll get to that maybe another time. We don't want to figure out how you got here, how did you get here? But who are your people?
Speaker 3:It's very interesting now with the venue because of you know, obviously a few years ago, with the publicity of the Obamas going every summer, and now you have this year, you had the series Forever and you know, in the Ralph Lauren collection. So now it's like a new spotlight on the vineyard, you know, because it was all and so some of the people were like, oh, the vineyard is like and I hate to sound like a dickhead, I'm like yo, it's been going on for like 60 years, bro, you're kind of late.
Speaker 2:More than that. It's like 200 years. It's like multi-generational. It's like multi-generational. It's 100 years. It's at least 100 years. Yeah.
Speaker 3:You're kind of late and that's fine. Yeah, you know, but just go up there and, like I hope, somebody's given the the newbies for lack of a better term these lessons like what to do and what not to do, and it's not about being bougie. It's not that. There's a kind of a protocol to it. You know, it's all you know, so.
Speaker 2:Yeah, most people. What I find is like most people because we've suddenly become the old school people, which I think is hilarious, because I don't feel that way. Um, I still like we bought a house that belonged to another family and there's a full on like three generations of people who, if they're like, where are you living at? I'm like we live in the Pope's house, and they're like oh, I know that house. I used to go there when I was a kid. So it's really funny because even at this point, we're still talking to people who lived there 20 years ago. But the thing about the vineyard what happens is people get on the island and either you immediately get it and you're like oh, this is for me, or you don't, and you're like what's the hype? I know plenty of people who think it's a slum.
Speaker 3:They're just like there are no good hotels, there's not a lot, it's not going to be a W.
Speaker 2:It's hilarious. It's not for that, no, no. And but what's happening that's crazy is all these West coast people, because of the film festival, like to your, like, take a step back even further. It's on the forever track because it, because of the film festival, it kind of seeped into that creative community. And you have.
Speaker 2:I believe, Canyon Barris has a house there now, like you see all of these like Hollywood people who are coming there. But let me tell you how now the Texas people are coming there. Somebody built an East Shop. They built a full-on somebody. I don't know if this is true, but my friend told me that they're from Sugar Land and they built a Sugarland texas house. In the middle of east top, with all these quaint new england cottages, is this gigantic house with two-story doors and glass and the windows are tinted and you're like it's so texas, it's really funny. So there's like a whole different, like the wet, where it used to just really be east coast. I've met so many people from the West coast who came for the film festival, fell in love, figured it out. But yeah, it is really it's a special place.
Speaker 2:It's really there's nothing like it.
Speaker 3:I hope you enjoyed it. Thank you.
Speaker 2:This is fun. You're the best. You're the best I did. I really enjoyed it and I feel like you know you're also. You're really good at this and just thank you it's just wonderful, it was really wonderful. I've never really threaded the, I've never thought about the threads of my career and you know it's just like just keep your head down.
Speaker 3:Just shutting up. Like I listen to the podcast and I hate the podcast hosts that don't shut up or always uh-huh like, like dude, just shut up. Like we're here, we want to hear what, the, what, the what the guest has to say. We don't need exactly what you mean just shut up, let them talk, that's we got them there and a lot of people don't do that, you know.
Speaker 2:I will. I will literally turn off the podcast when they do that let the person talk, but thank you and I love.
Speaker 2:I love one of the things I love about what you're doing. I just have to say this too, that one of the things I love about what you're doing. I just have to say this too, that one of the things I love about what you're doing is, you know, yes, there are artists, but, like, if you look at, if I look at my career, and I think of all the artists whose lives I touched and impacted, like that it's so incredible to be a part of that community and to have had the opportunity to change people's lives. And my check-in with new artists was always um, how's the airport? That was always my measure. I'd be like how's the airport? And they used to always like I would never explain. I would just be like how's the airport? And they'd be like why do you always ask me that? I remember asking Chris that I was like what's the airport? Like, how's the airport? I can't even walk through the airport sky caps.
Speaker 3:The lady at Annie's presser was like oh my god, you know you get the job. You know you get the job exactly.
Speaker 2:I did my job. That's how I know I did my job, and when you can't walk to the airport, I am a success. So but thank you, jeff, and thank you for all of the support over the years as well. You've been a wonderful friend and love you to pieces.
Speaker 3:I love you too, lisa. You can catch Mixed and Mastered on Apple Podcasts, spotify, iHeart or wherever you get your podcasts. Hit that follow button, leave a review and tell a friend. I'm your host, jeffrey Sledge. Mixed and Mastered is produced and distributed by Merrick Studios.
