Mixed and Mastered
Mixed and Mastered is the podcast where the untold stories of the music industry come to life. Hosted by Jeffrey Sledge, a veteran music executive and former VP of A&R at Atlantic Records and Jive Records, each episode dives deep into the journeys, challenges, and triumphs of the people shaping the sound of today. From label executives and producers to artists, songwriters, and managers, Jeffrey brings you behind the scenes to meet the minds driving the industry forward. There’s a gap in the marketplace for these voices, and Mixed and Mastered is here to fill it—one conversation at a time. Because the best stories are told by those who lived them.
Mixed and Mastered
Shawn Barron
How do unknown artists become household names? On this episode of Mixed and Mastered, legendary A&R Shawn Barron pulls back the curtain on the moves that shaped modern music—from discovering Drake on MySpace to signing Ty Dolla $ign against all odds, and spotting Leon Thomas at a traffic light.
Shawn keeps it real on trusting your gut over chasing trends, almost signing Kendrick Lamar, and crafting hits with Kanye West and Bruno Mars. This episode is packed with rare industry gems—tap in and hear how the hits really get Mixed and Mastered.
Mixed and Mastered is produced and distributed by Merrick Studio, and hosted by music industry veteran, Jeffrey Sledge. Tune in to the discussion on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you catch your podcasts. Follow us on Instagram @MixedandMasteredPod to join the conversation and support the show at https://mixedandmasteredpod.buzzsprout.com/
Welcome to Mixed and Mastered, the podcast where the stories of the music industry come to life. I'm Jeffrey Sledge, bringing you real conversations with the people who have shaped the sound of music. We're pulling back the curtain on what it takes to make it in the music business. These are the stories you won't hear anywhere else, told by the people who live them. This is Mixed and Mastered. Okay, we're here at Mixed and Mastered. One of my favorite people, sean Barry from Buffalo, new York. Buffalo's finest, appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Yeah, man, thank you for appearing, man. I'm looking forward to this interview. It's going me. Yeah, man, thank you for appearing man. I'm looking forward to this interview. It's going to be good man, so like.
Speaker 1:I said you grew up in Buffalo, new York, you know, with Westside, gunn and Benny and all those guys. Yes, sir, home of Rick James. Yes, sir, wait, do y'all count? Is it Niagara Falls? That's not you. Is that Buffalo? I mean, I mean, that's close enough, it's close enough, right, close enough. It's like 20 minutes away, exactly in the home of the. I remember years ago, man, when I did I did promotions before I did um A&R and in one of my stations was WBLK okay, yeah, in Buffalo. And I remember going up there and a guy the program director, music director at the time, the guy named Roger, came in his last name. He's good dude. He took me to the place where he said they invented buffalo wings, the Anchor Bar yeah, some restaurant, those are not the best wings. They wasn't really fine. But I was like these ain't really that good. I respect you bringing me here, but these ain't really lit.
Speaker 3:It's other spots way better, way I figured.
Speaker 1:Tell me a little bit about growing up in buffalo.
Speaker 3:No, it was good I had a had a cool childhood. Was was heavy going outside every day with my friends. Uh was playing basketball almost every day. That was like my thing. Yeah, just had. I had a cool childhood just riding my bike around the neighborhood.
Speaker 1:Regular kid stuff.
Speaker 3:Yeah, regular kid stuff outside every day. The computer didn't come until later on. I think I got a computer when I was in eighth or ninth grade, so that's when that came along and then I was more so on the computer and doing all that stuff. But yeah, just regular childhood regular. How did you?
Speaker 1:tap into the music.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, I think my mom had a part to play in that. She was always playing music around the house. My cousin was a DJ and he still is a DJ. Shout out to Jay Tech, he's a DJ down here in Atlanta right now. Okay, he was at the radio station at V106. Okay, so shout out107. Okay, so shout out to him. Sorry about that. No, that's all good. Yeah, so shout out to him.
Speaker 3:He was a DJ. He put me on to a lot of stuff. I remember hearing early Nas, early Big L, all that stuff from him. So shout out to him. And then I just think that, yeah, I just loved music. I was always into it. I was always looking for the newest songs. I was always looking for the new artists and, yeah, just being outside too, like in here, having cars go by and just playing all the new stuff. I remember hearing nori for the first time, n-o-r-e nori. I had Nori for the first time, n-o-r-e Nori. I had somebody inspire for the first time and I was like what's that? Yeah, just all stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Being in it, yeah, being in it. So you played ball. You still play, man, I haven't played ball in forever. You gave it up. You let it go.
Speaker 3:I got to get back out there, though. No, I want to get back out there, I just haven't.
Speaker 1:I haven't played you busy, you busy every time, you know yeah busy.
Speaker 3:Uh, grew up playing. Baldo was playing every day, hours and hours a day. Yeah, when I went to high school I ended up playing. Varsity started for three years. I got some accomplishments first team all catholic because I went to a catholic school, okay. So yeah, I was a hooper cool, cool, cool.
Speaker 1:And I know, I know the hooping took you to college. You played in seton hall yep, yep, I didn't play.
Speaker 3:So I made the team, but I ended up not playing okay the coach was like, since I was a walk-on, it really wasn't a spot for me. He was like you'll make the team, you'll practice with the team, you'll travel, but you're not gonna play in any games. And that sort of like discouraged me. But I should have just kept going because I was good. I would probably ended up playing, but I just let those words discourage me and then was looking for my next outlet and that's when music came into the spotlight. So tell us about that. How did that happen? Yeah, my homie a butter. He was a rapper and he was like yo, you should manage me. And I didn't know what to do. So I went and got an internship and I ended up interning at Republic Records, the building on 57th and Broadway. I was going there three times a week and just learning a bunch of stuff.
Speaker 1:It was cool. Who'd you work for over at Republic?
Speaker 3:I worked for it was this dude named Jordan Walker, and so I interned in new media, which is like digital marketing, now Yep Slash A&R.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 3:And at that time sorry about that At that time it was MySpace. That was like the big thing.
Speaker 3:So he was searching for artists on MySpace and he like taught me like how to go through the three columns and search for all the artists you could like pinpoint cities, countries. It was crazy, yeah, yeah. Three columns and searched for all the artists you could like pinpoint cities, countries. It was crazy, yeah, yeah, yeah. He taught me how to do that and the first artist who I came up on doing that was drake and that sort of like led to you know, that's crazy.
Speaker 1:That's crazy. So I know you said you reached out to drake and had a conversation with him so I I reached out to.
Speaker 3:So after my internship I started working at Koch, so this was the time when Jim Jones was over there. He had just dropped balling. Dj Khaled was over there. Ray J was over there when he did sexy, can I?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, yeah it was.
Speaker 3:It was a real machine at that time.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, I hit Drake up like months before I even started working at Koch. I hit him, he hit me back, he sent me his info and he just so happened to be in New York for a Degrassi thing. So I remember he was like yo come meet with me the day before the meeting. So we went to his hotel he was staying at the the time hotel, okay, yeah, yeah, the time will tell you. Stand there with me and my homie danny went there. We chopped it up with him and the next day we brought him in for a meeting with alan. And what was the vibe?
Speaker 3:like back then um, he was super cool. He just wanted to work. I remember him like mentioning kanye and pharrell at that time, which is funny, where you know, yeah, um yeah, he was super cool, super humble. Um, I mean, he still seems the same way to this day. I haven't spoken to him in forever, but he still seems like a humble guy, yeah, but uh, yeah, we brought him up there. They unfortunately passed on them and then I just started telling other people about them and that's how I met mike karen okay, okay, so tell me about that.
Speaker 3:Well, mike, mike, mike the scientist, yeah so, uh, it's funny, me and my homie danny, we was doing like unsigned artist showcases in new york, so uh where did you do those showcases in New York?
Speaker 1:Where did you do those showcases? Man I got to remember.
Speaker 3:We did them at two different places. I forgot which places they were, but the first one we had Mickey Facts, we had Currency, we had Nipsey Wow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was crazy, the people you had eventually got signed. Yeah, yeah, they eventually got signed.
Speaker 3:We was definitely on to something. So, uh, we had made a flyer and we just emailed the fly. We got a list of industry contacts and we just emailed it to everybody and mike caron hit me back. He was like yo, this is dope. He's like send me whatever artists and producers that you think I should be looking at. So I sent him drake and I sent him a bunch of other stuff that I was looking at at the time.
Speaker 3:And we stayed in contact and right after so, 2009 came around and we all got laid off at Koch. It was the recession and it was just one of those times. So I was like what am I going to do next? So I found this artist on MySpace. His name was Amiro Bay at that time. He's going by Fresh, he Does it and I sent it to Mike and Mike was like yo, this is crazy. He flew us out to LA literally the next week and then he signed him and gave me a job at Atlantic.
Speaker 1:So Amiro Bay, that's not the kid from Portland.
Speaker 3:No, no, he's from well, he's from Detroit, okay, and Brooklyn, he's from both, but I think he just he was signed to Def Jam after he got off Atlantic okay, okay, yeah, cool.
Speaker 1:So you got him signed over.
Speaker 3:Atlantic. And, yeah, he gave me an A&R job and and literally got thrown into the fire. I didn't know what I was doing. I was just up there.
Speaker 1:I knew music, of course the process of doing a and r how to make records, and I didn't really know what I was doing but, in the fire and I learned, I learned quickly.
Speaker 3:he definitely taught me like the process of song making and and making hit songs and all that stuff and I just took it and I soaked it in and I just added it to you know because, because I go for feeling, so I added the process of making a hit record to the feeling and it's history ever since.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I hate to sound like the old dude you know what I'm saying back in my day, but I think that a lot of what you said, that feeling thing, is missing more now. There are records that have feeling it's not like nobody's doing it. There are plenty of people doing it. You know Drake, kendrick, future, whatever we could keep naming them. But there are a lot of people that don't understand that feeling part. No, for sure, I agree. I mean, I think that's why there's a lot of older records that still you know the Michael Jacksons or you know Teddy Pendergrass, whatever they still 40, 50 years later. It's because of how they feel.
Speaker 1:For sure they're great records too, those records come out today and still like hit the same way, absolutely, because again, they're great songs, you know they're written properly, all that stuff. Because, again, they're great songs, you know they're written properly, all that stuff. You just hear something that just feels inside your body as it pauses, instead of just like this is a great record, but it doesn't make you feel any kind of way, you know? Sure. So, without giving away all my secrets, tell us a little bit about what you learned about the process of actually making records from him. Definitely.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I was in the studio for my first two, three years nonstop. First we were up at Paramount and then we were there for a year and then he ended up buying that building on Cahuenga. We were in that building. So I was literally in the studio from 11 am until whenever I left, every day, and we were having every major songwriter, every major producer in the game coming up, you know, making songs for us. So you got to think like Miguel early, Miguel early, Miguel early Frank Ocean early.
Speaker 3:Ty Dolla, $ign early, jeremiah early whoever you could think of was coming up there writing songs for us and producing for us. So it was just an amazing time up there going to his. He had a. He had a rule book in every room with several rules of song writing and I mean they. They worked. So one of the rules was like repetition. Another one was like when you spell something like Boosie, did I N, d, e, it's like that always works. Asking a question like it was just a whole bunch of different things that you implement to the song to, like you know, make sure it was a hit and I don't know Again.
Speaker 1:You know I hate to sound like you sound like the back of my day guy because I don't know how it goes now but what you said about all those people coming through the studio you really learn a lot by watching how people work. I'm sure Frank and Ty don't work the same, even though they both are phenomenal, but they have different approaches so you kind of learn things. When I worked at Jive, the studio was called Battery Studios. We were on 10, and Battery was in the same building. It was on 7. So we'd always go downstairs and I learned so much about sitting in the studio and watching people work and how they use this and how they make beats and how they really kind of soak up a lot of information. So I just hope you had that experience.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, I mean even more. I mean Bruno used to be in there before. He had a record that went crazy. So yeah, just sitting in there seeing these people's processes and how they make songs, I just soaked it all up.
Speaker 1:Is anybody in particular that stood out I mean, besides Ty, we'll get to later particular that stood out to you as far as their processes and how they worked?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean a lot of people. Pop Ronsel was another one who was early.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 3:Seeing him work was amazing, man. I mean it was so literally we had like the pick of the pick when we was working, so it was just everybody who was in there. It was just a great time.
Speaker 1:That's incredible. Um so now wait, do you work? You worked with johnny shakes for a minute as well, correct?
Speaker 3:so after I got let go from kotch then I worked with shipes for like three or four months oh quick it was quick. Yeah, it was real quick, but uh, it was still impactful. I still learned a lot over there. I remember he had me take like eight boxes of mixtapes. It was Nipsey Bullets, ain't Got no Name. I forgot which volume it was, but he had me take like eight boxes on this cart to the mail, to UPS. It was crazy.
Speaker 1:Walking down the street.
Speaker 3:Yeah, walking down the street with eight big boxes of mixtapes to get them out.
Speaker 1:It was crazy, now had he signed joy badass by that point it was.
Speaker 3:It was just nipsey and I think he had smoked and I'm trying to think did he have anybody else? Nipsey was like the main focus grinding it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's cool. So so you worked with Mike, you signed your guy, and so after that you worked with him.
Speaker 3:So after I got Fresh signed then technically that wasn't my signing, that was Mike's signing. He signed our artist.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:My first signing was Diggy Simmons, so I brought him up there and this was Did you connect with diggy via kind of watching the, the.
Speaker 3:at that time the reality show runs house, or you just know he had put out a freestyle where he was rapping on the rooftop and everybody had started to see it and it was going viral at that time and I was like man, this kid is crazy. Through my homie brad I knew one of diggy's friends and I reached out to him and he connected us on the phone. Okay, yeah. And then we started chopping it up. I met with Rev and the whole team, perry and Chris Lighty yeah, yeah, rest in peace. Yeah, but yeah, I sat with them and then we brought them up and we ended up doing a deal. Wow. And then, right after we did the deal, he did another freestyle. Then Kanye had this thing called Kanye University where he was just posting. I remember that he ended up posting Diggy and then it just like boom.
Speaker 1:It was like crazy yeah, lucky you already had him signed by that point. Yep, yep, it would have been super competitive. For sure. So I always wanted to ask that, because as A&R people, we always have these stories. Is Diggy your one that you thought was going to go but it just didn't work? Was it kind of like I know it's you? Was it just not the time for him? Because sometimes things are way ahead of?
Speaker 3:time. Yeah, I think it was timing. I feel like at that time it was a lot of kid artists at that time, so it was Diggy. And then it was like Lil Twist time. It was a lot of kid artists at that time, so it was diggy, and then it was like little twists and it was mindless behavior and jacob latimore and it was just like a certain resurgence of kids.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we had like at the head of that was diggy and mindless behavior. Those was like the two who were like standing out and we we had a hit record on diggy, the record with jeremiah that did great. But uh, yeah, when we put out this it just and I attribute a lot of that to like music, digital downloads at that time too- Break it down. We weren't in the streaming area yet, so a lot of people were just pirating his album. So I feel like you know that contributed. It was just a weird time in music.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. Sometimes it's not really the you know you. You'd be like did I make a mistake? It's like, nah, nah, that's just that you know the timing or something, or a hiccup in the road, whatever, somebody, maybe your boss, got fired, it's all kind of 100 things that could kind of sway in our career from being what you thought it was going to be to not quite making that jump. It's not that the was whack, it was just kind of like things were. Just you know I think he was respected.
Speaker 3:I think people respected the project, uh, and I think that I mean I don't think I know he had a hit. He had a hit single, um, so I know that that gave us like a diving board. But then he's sort of like I feel like he was in the spotlight a lot in his younger age and he sort of like wanted to shy away from it after we put out that album. So he didn't like keep going. If we would have kept going, then we would have beat. You know what we supposed to do?
Speaker 1:Yeah, Because it doesn't always happen.
Speaker 3:No, it never happens on the first go. You got to just keep going. Yeah, yeah, he kind of checked out a little bit. Yeah, he kind of checked out. So then that left me in a kind of bad predicament and I was like, what am I gonna do? So, uh, I know I had ty coming to the studio just writing and you know doing a lot of stuff. I got him a placement on trey songs album and you know a couple other things. He was like yo, I got this mixtape I want you to hear. It ended up being Beach House 1. I was like man, this is amazing. I ended up signing him.
Speaker 1:I remember my boy Ike. He played that tape for me the first time. He was like you heard this Ty Dolla $ign guy. I think I might have heard Ty sing on a couple of records, but I didn't know it would work. And I was like you know, I ain't going to lie, I was being a dickhead. I was like nah, I ain't heard that. You know what I mean. He sings on some people's songs and he played the tape and, like you said, I was like wait, what? Yeah, this like I just thought he was like a singer stuck on a couple hooks. I didn't know the depth of his talent.
Speaker 3:It was like jesus guys yeah, you know, I mean neither, neither did atlantic when I first signed him either, just going back to that. So when I first signed him, not gonna say who, but then, uh, when I, when I, right before I signed, it was like yo, he's a disgrace to the label. And they went back and told craig. So I never forget, forget, I was in Atlanta with Allie boy. Allie boy, yeah.
Speaker 1:We got to get to him too. I know I was in Atlanta with Allie boy.
Speaker 3:He was in Hot Beats I'll never forget. And Craig called me. He was like. He was like. Craig was like someone so said that Ty Dolla is a disgrace to the label. He's like why are we signing him? And I just snapped he's like, calm down, calm down. He's like we're going to sign him. We're going to sign him.
Speaker 1:But you know what, knowing Craig, if you hadn't have spazzed, you might not have got the deal. I think he was. I'm talking shit because I was over there, but knowing Craig a bit, he probably was also testing your passion for it. Yeah, I think he was. Yeah, you going to put your foot down? Are you going to like, let me kind of sway you away from this? Are you going to like push through? So that was good that you spazzed, you know obviously, yeah, spazzed, we got the deal done.
Speaker 3:But they still didn't get it at first. But the one person who did get it was young Jeezy. He was in our meetings at the time. He was a SVP or VP at the time. Then I brought him in to do some things and he heard yeah, when I played Beach House 1 in our meeting, jeezy was like man, this shit is crazy. He was like man, this kid about to be huge.
Speaker 1:It was crazy.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he knew he was crazy. He ended up popping on one of the records and did the video with Ty and that was like the big first moment for us.
Speaker 1:That's dope. So before we move forward I need to hear, like at least one. So I didn't know Allie Boy, but when I was in college I was trying to sign Big Bang, big Bang, yeah, and he had the record with Candy Burris. Yep, yep, I had my boy City. He knew him and we did a whole meeting. The bank came out. See, candy wasn't there. But the bank came, was his man named Rico? Yeah, rico, yeah, rico was there. It was right before Christmas of whatever year that was, and that's the case. We met at the hotel lobby at the W in Atlanta and I liked the bank. I mean everybody kind of told me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, everybody kind of told me. Yeah, they kind of told me what you know, where they come from or whatever. That never scares me, but I really liked him. I was like boy, I like this guy, Like he's like really cool, real personable, like it wasn't on no funny shit. We didn't get the deal done. I'll tell you offline what happened, but we didn't get the deal done. I was really disappointed, but that's. They were mentioning Ali because he was part of the Duckman crew at the time. So tell us one or two Ali stories.
Speaker 3:I mean, I have so many stories Without a crew, there ain't nobody, yeah, I mean. So one story I remember is we used to record in these apartments. I don't remember where they was, I just know they was in the hood. This is like it was crazy, so I'm we turned in there every day recording in this hood spot, and I remember I met this dude named Killer B there and Killer B just did Beyonce. He's up for a Grammy today.
Speaker 1:What.
Speaker 3:Yeah, which is crazy. He was in this little hood-ass apartment making music with us, but now he's up, I forgot it might be 16 Carriages or whatever song wow wow yeah, you never know, you never know I met color b in the hood with alley boy.
Speaker 3:That was crazy. Another time I'll never forget it was suge knight, alley boy. Who else was in there? The basketball player, who's crazy? Ron artes, no, not ron artis. Man, what's his name? Stephen jackson? Yeah, stack, yeah, all in the studio, guns falling on the ground, like I'm like man, I gotta get the hell up out here. I remember something one of the homeboys guns fell on the ground and it was like aimed towards me but it didn't go off and I was like, oh, this is my cue, I got to go. Wow, that's funny, man, that's funny. I loved Allie Boy though that's my brother. I was with him almost every day for like a year and we did some great things. It just didn't translate the way. Alley Boy, big Bank yeah, yeah, that was like a movement.
Speaker 1:You were kind of early in it, yeah.
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Speaker 1:Cool and tell us a little bit about Cap G, who you also signed Atlantic.
Speaker 3:Yeah, cap G. So KP a shout out to KP. He ended up signing Cap G. I want to say he signed Cap G around the same time that I ended up signing Ty.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 3:So he was on the label. I know they was trying to figure it out. And then, right before I want to say like a year or two years later, before KP was about to leave the label, he had called me down to Atlanta to come to the studio and I came by and he was like yo, I respect what you're doing. He's like I want you to work on Cap G and, you know, try to help us figure it out. So I was like, yeah, let's do it. So we played music in that meeting and they played me two songs that they felt like was the single. It was one with Young Thug and then it was the song called Girlfriend and they had all wanted to go with the Young Thug song and I was like, nah, girlfriend is the one. And you know I picked right because it ended up being his first platinum single. Wow, I took it back to LA, I had my homie Dre Sinatra start spinning it on the radio in LA and, yeah, the rest was history with that one. Wow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, cap. I really think Cap was, as it happens, a lot with doing A&R. I think Cap was ahead of the curve.
Speaker 3:For sure he was.
Speaker 1:I think he was. I mean he ahead of the curve, for sure I think he was. I mean he's super talented, super dope, good looking kid, all that. I just think that he, a couple years later, by the, connected. But it's almost like the market wasn't ready for him yet, for sure you know it wasn't he's still so talented.
Speaker 3:He has a great voice, a great look and he's just a great kid too, like, yeah, the best personality. So, yeah, I still want to see him do well. Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 3:I feel like it may be. He was just sometimes you, just you like you too ahead of the curve, and that might have been, you know what it was.
Speaker 1:That's my Bun B. He always says that to me. He's like you always be too up to in front man, you be too early, you be too early. You know, and that's happened. You grab something, you sign something, and it's like they didn't see where it was going. Yep, you know, you see it, but they don't see it. And then later on another actor's like that's what I was trying to do, but you know, that's the game. Yep, it is. I think it's still better to be ahead of the curve than behind it. It is.
Speaker 3:Because you're behind it. You're just chasing all the time. You're just chasing whatever's popping, you're trying to find the next and most of the time when you're chasing that sound, you're not going to crack on that sound. It's too far out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's too far out. I hate when people bring me something and be like yo. They're like the new Young Thug. I'm like we already need like Young Thug Part 2. You know what I'm saying? You find somebody who's doing something else. You know For sure, so tell us so you worked at?
Speaker 3:how long were you at Atlantic altogether? I was at Atlantic for a little over 10 years, from November of 09 to January of 2020.
Speaker 1:Beautiful, beautiful.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I had to run. I had a long run. I think at that time that I left. I was the longest term A&R there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so, yeah, yeah, yeah. You were there for a minute. You saw a lot of changes.
Speaker 3:We changed buildings, yeah, we went from 6th Avenue over to Broadway, yeah, then we went from Sixth Avenue over to Broadway, yeah, and then, of course, mike Caron, I seen him come and go. I seen, yeah, it was just a lot, my very first, my first or second meeting I'll never forget. So we had. It was Mike Caron, daryl Jones, it was G Jean, it was Andrew Luffman was in there, it was Mr Morgan who worked with Drake in there.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, yes, yes yes, this dude's V Edelman was in there, Wait see see he did something, Was he he's?
Speaker 1:is he a lawyer now? He did something big he was a lawyer.
Speaker 3:I'm not sure I haven't heard from him in a long time. Wow, yeah, that was our anr staff. It was a bunch of killers in there and uh, how were those meetings crazy? So this I'm so I never forget leor kicked the door and like it's like you motherfuckers better have some hit records. I was like, oh my, what the fuck is going on? The meetings used to be crazy.
Speaker 1:I bet Out of crazy comes creativity and out of creativity comes hits For sure. And you know people, you know. I don't know if people know or not know, but the best companies, best record companies, to me, are always driven by A&R or A&R people. They are, whether it's back in the day with, like you know, reeve Martin or something like that, or even with LA Reid, or you know those people. You know they should get wild sometimes, you know, but the hits come from that. You know For sure, it comes from that. You know it comes from that. You know. So, yeah, and the and the. You know the other special case too. You know what.
Speaker 1:I'm saying Um, so you went. After Atlantic, you went to Motown.
Speaker 3:Yup. After Atlantic I went to Motown Um. I spent three years there. Ethiopia brought me over. It was cool. I worked on, I worked on the Migos, I worked on offset. I signed Leon over there. I signed LA over there. I worked on Kim, the R&B artist. That was great working with him yeah, it was cool.
Speaker 1:So again, without incriminating nobody, because I don't want to fucking raise money or whatever can you tell me one maybe wild is a stretch, because that kind of tastes like drugs and I don't not that, but what was an interesting, interesting Migos story.
Speaker 3:Damn it Interesting. You know, I wasn't really in the studio with them too much, too much. It was sort of like just collecting, so I wasn't overseeing when we, when we worked on his solo project though, we were in the studio a lot together, okay, and how was that? No, I mean, he's super talented, nice guy. He like listens to ideas, so, yeah, it was good working with him. I don't know if I have no crazy stories about him, but yeah, yeah, working with offset that's all good, and so let's talk.
Speaker 1:let's talk a little about Leon. Yep, so you signed Leon over there.
Speaker 3:Yep. So me and Ty had came up with a label and I was like I'm going to take it over here.
Speaker 1:No, question Because it is a label, it's called Easy Money. It's called Easy Money Because it's E-Z-M-N-Y. I was trying to make sure I was saying it right.
Speaker 3:I was trying to make sure I was saying it right.
Speaker 1:It's called.
Speaker 3:Easy Money. We created the label in January of 22 or 23. I don't remember what year I brought it to Ethiopia and she's like yeah, we'd love to do this. She's like y'all just got to find an artist you did the label with no artist on it.
Speaker 1:Yet With no artist on it, sign. Yeah, that's, that's rare. Yeah, nowadays an artist is already attached.
Speaker 3:That's interesting yep, yep so I did the label no artists with signs I was in traffic with. I was in traffic well, it wasn't even traffic. I was outside during the pandemic and there was nobody outside. And then leon comes pulling up next to me in his car and we got the red light. So I look, look over and I'm like yo what's up.
Speaker 3:I hadn't seen him in years. That's crazy. It is God, it's crazy. It's amazing, amazing. But yeah, he was like yo, I got this project. I want you to hear it. I'm going to call you later on today. So he called me, he sent me the project. It ended up being Electric Dusk, which was his last project we put out last year. And yeah, I heard it and I was like man, this shit is amazing, this kid is like the one. So I went, I played it for Ty, we had a meet and meet him and Ty, and then the rest has been history.
Speaker 1:So the project it was done. Did you do any changes to the?
Speaker 3:project. It was done minus one song that we added, which was Crash and Burn, which ended up being one of the big songs. But yeah, it was pretty much done.
Speaker 1:That's crazy. It's very rare you find that. Yeah, at Java I signed Nivea. Okay, that's crazy. Her project was done like that. They presented it to me. It was like don't message your man. All that stuff was already there, we didn't even touch it. That's crazy. So it's rare you could find somebody who's done.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he had this project done for like four years already, so he was just holding it, making sure, like. So all the music that you heard from that project was like four or five years old, which is crazy. It didn't age and it like ushered in a new sound to r&b.
Speaker 1:So there's the same with her. She was signed. She was signed in noontime. Yeah, noone had all the producers and writers b Brian Michael Cox. Those guys signed to him so she was just working, like I said, three, four years as like a you know, demo and songs and writing songs, and so that's what she presented. This stuff was already there. It's crazy, yeah, you get it's very hard to do that more marketing, you know. Yeah, so leon's leon's project, which is grammy nominated, which is insane, yeah, that's a great fucking album, bro.
Speaker 1:That guy it blew me away. You know it's. It's hard to find those records where it's like the production, production level so high and layered yeah me kind of things. You listen to it like two or three times ago I didn't even notice. You know that string line like that or whatever it was.
Speaker 3:And then on top of that his writing for sure top lines are like ridiculous he just found, like his, his team of guys so he works with, with two guys like who are his team on the production and then he also produces too. And then, yeah, his writing. He found, like his counterpart, with this guy busy crook, who were actually about to sign to Easy Money too. Ok, OK. And yeah they, they just made a masterpiece.
Speaker 1:I mean, I prefer albums like that was still contained to like the crew, you know, because then it creates a sound and a vibe and all that stuff. It's supposed to like. 10 songs, eight producers, cause even if even if those albums have the hits, it's kind of almost like a compilation. Yup, you know it's not really an album. It's like okay, you got five hits.
Speaker 3:It's not cohesive.
Speaker 1:It's not cohesive, exactly, yeah, but Leon's amazing man. He's one of my favorite new people, man, so good luck tonight, are you going?
Speaker 3:No, no, so he's actually not up tonight. He's not up for a Grammy tonight, so he won a Grammy last year for Scissors.
Speaker 1:Snooze.
Speaker 3:And we missed the deadline on the album, so it's probably going to be up. Well, God willing, it's going to be up for next year's Grammy.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, whatever, the album's crazy, so congratulations anyway Ties up for two Grammys tonight, though.
Speaker 1:Wow, as he deserves. Is it for the Kanye stuff?
Speaker 3:Yeah for the Kanye stuff.
Speaker 1:Did you get to any of those sessions?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I was there when they was making Carnival.
Speaker 1:Wow, okay, okay, okay, give me a little piece of that. Again we don't incriminate nobody on this show. We want to hear the story, ain't nobody, but it was.
Speaker 3:We was at the hotel in. Damn, what hotel was that? It's in West Hollywood, when you go up the Little Hill.
Speaker 1:Oh, the Chateau Marmont.
Speaker 3:Yep, chateau Marmont. So we was in there in a room. It was pitch black in there, the vibe was crazy, but yeah, they was working on a carnival.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's amazing. That's yo. Congratulations to Ty for the nominations and I think they'll win. I think they'll win, I mean Carnival was a massive record.
Speaker 3:God willing, God willing yeah.
Speaker 1:I think they'll win, you know. So then, from Motown, you went to Empire Yep, you worked with Ghazi. Tell us a little bit about that.
Speaker 3:No, it was good. I had been talking to Ghazi for a minute and he was like yo come over here and, you know, try to help me do some things. So I went over there and, yeah, just learned a lot from on the independent side, because it's completely different from my first two jobs at Atlantic. Well, my second and third job at Atlantic and Motown Completely different how they do things. Third job at Atlantic and Motown Completely different how they do things. It's more so like the artists. They just come and they turn in their project when it's done and you know, then they come in and try to, you know, bring some marketing services to it and the DSPs and all that stuff. But yeah, it was cool. It taught me a lot for my label.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly yeah. So the A&R process at a place like an empire, I'm assuming it's not as hands-on as it would be at the majors.
Speaker 3:I mean with certain artists, yes, but they have so many artists that I think is more so in bulk that they try to sign things and you might catch a win over here with something you weren't even thinking about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and it's. I guess with that many artists, it's it. You can't be hands-on because it's too much, too much coming down the system. Yeah, touch everything and say changes to that. You gotta kind of sign them and then trust they know what you know, they know what they're doing and they know their audience, what the audience wants you know. So you left Empire, now you're just doing Easy Money, fully, yep.
Speaker 3:I'm just doing Easy Money full-time. Now I'm doing some management, so I got two management clients.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 3:For Fargo, who's been doing well. He's had like two or three songs go viral already. Okay, so I'm super excited about him.
Speaker 1:I got LA who's's a management client and he was signed to atlantic back in the day then I'm doing easy money, me and ty.
Speaker 3:We got leon over there and yeah we got the rolling yeah, we rolling, that's cool man congratulations, man, it's a blessing to hit on your first one um man lesson.
Speaker 1:That's a super blessing. You know, what I want to ask you is and i'm'm going to this is a question I'm going to ask a lot of people what do you think? How has streaming changed obviously, the business, and how has streaming changed your opinion, your approach to doing A&R?
Speaker 3:I mean, I feel like streaming has helped the business. The business was dying before streaming, so it's definitely helped in that way. But I feel like they still have to get the rates right to pay the songwriters and the producers. They still have to figure that out for sure so that I hope in in the next coming year, six months, that they, you know, can figure that out. But, um, yeah, streaming, I know before streaming you know was it was set digital downloads and still trying to sell cds and stuff like that and it just wasn't working. So streaming helped. But does it change my approach to anr? No, I still go for the things that I feel, the things that I feel like are ahead, like, like you said, I always want to be ahead of the curve too. I'd rather be ahead and missed than be behind and missed.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so yeah, I just want to be ahead of the curve on things. I want to do things that I'm passionate about and that I love, and yeah, that's it. There's no data or TikTok or whatever that could make me, you know, move on something. I did that one time and I regretted it.
Speaker 1:Why did you regret it?
Speaker 3:Because it didn't work out and I was just chasing like numbers in a trend and that's not how I got to where I am today. When I signed Ty, he had absolutely nothing going on. Signed Leon, he had absolutely nothing going on and it was just great music that I believed in. So we have to keep the music first.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I always felt like with the chasing, the numbers and analytics, it's a very dangerous game because if something's popping now, by the time you do the process and sign it and everything you've missed out.
Speaker 3:You've missed it.
Speaker 1:It's gone. It's three months later or sometimes even more, and it's like whatever that thing was, that was hot, is now gone and the kids on those platforms have moved on.
Speaker 1:And so now you're trying to regenerate something that they've moved on, and then a lot of times also with those artists, respectfully, they don't quite know what they're doing. They kind of stepped in shit. So when you ask them to do it again, they're like I don't even know what I did the first time. Right, you know what I'm saying. So it's kind of that's real.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm saying. So it's kind of a dangerous game, man. You know, tell me an artist that you wanted. Well, you told me about drake, but if there's another artist that you wanted to sign, but uh, but you didn't because you know for for whatever reason it's been a list of them.
Speaker 3:I know you got this conversation offline. Yeah, I mean you go back to drake. He's the biggest artist in the world, uh, andrick, so go. It's a story about that.
Speaker 3:So I was in new york for I forgot what I was in new york for. But I was in new New York for the week, up at the old Atlantic office, and Kendrick was sitting in his little room to the side of Craig's office. So I went in there and I was chopping it up with him and then Craig was like, coming to the meeting with me and listen to this kid. I don't know nothing about him, but come listen to him. So we get in the meeting and Kendrick plays the intro from Overly Dedicated, and he played that one song and I was like sign him now. Like this kid is the fucking one. So of course they were slow footing.
Speaker 3:So I went back to LA the next week and I told Mike Karen. I was like yo, I just heard this shit. You got to meet with this kid named Kendrick and I set up the meeting. So they came in there and they met with Mike Karen and it ended up not happening. It ended up not happening. Yeah, I just knew from that one song I was like oh my God, this kid is fucking amazing.
Speaker 1:Yo, I remember there was this kid You'll laugh when I but there was this kid. You'll laugh when I but there was this kid I got kids had stumbled on music. It might've been I don't know, it might've been MySpace. It's a long time ago. It might've been MySpace or it might've been the LimeWire era, whatever, but I stumbled on this kid's music and it was real like weird, but it was kind of.
Speaker 1:It was very dark and weird, but I liked it. I was like I don't know something about this kid, I like it. He was talking crazy and I kept playing and playing and I remember playing it for other I was just at the Jive Days and I was playing it for other A&R people at Jive and they were like you like this shit. I was like yo, there's something there, man, and it was like this is trash. I think I talked about it in one of our meetings and basically I laughed at the meeting Like you bugging out, and I kept I was like yo, I don't know what it is, but there's something here and he's going on to do things I never thought he would do.
Speaker 1:It's Tyler, wow, it was. What was it? Was it Bastard or Goblin? One of those first mixtapes I forget which one. It was one of his first mixtapes and he was like you know he was talking super crazy back then but I was like I don't know, like something is compelling to me. Yeah, yeah, but you know, if you do A&R long enough, you got these stories. Yeah, I mean listen.
Speaker 3:I got plenty of them. I know Jenea was another one who I had Wow, brought her up Party Next Door Did you have Tiller? No, I didn't have Tiller.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 3:Party Next Door. I had Ty and Party Next Door and they told me I could only sign one of them and I ended up signing.
Speaker 1:Ty Signing Ty yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, I could go down a whole list of them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's the game. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3:It's the game.
Speaker 1:So tell me three of your favorite artists, and why. And again, any genre, any, any. It could be old, new, it doesn't matter favorite.
Speaker 3:I feel like this kind of easy. So jay-z, michael jackson, stevie wonder okay, I mean, they're obvious that you know.
Speaker 1:Just tell me what hit you about each of them to make you you know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, I feel like Jay-Z was my era, when I was in high school, so I just remember Volume 2 coming out, volume 1. I remember them coming out in, you know, especially Volume 2, though, because that's when he started to really, really crack.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 3:I remember the blueprint coming out right before September 11th or September 11th, the day it came out, I believe, the towers fell and his season came out.
Speaker 1:Yep, so I went to. He had a. He had a concert that week. That's crazy. And I went to the show. It was crazy. I still call it the Manhattan center, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, just the memories, like, but all I mean he's just the best rapper ever to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. And what about michael?
Speaker 3:then I mean the best artist ever, the biggest artist ever, with the best songs. He got perfect albums perfect albums, yeah, perfect, I don't know I mean it's very few people who got perfect albums. He got perfect albums, albums.
Speaker 1:Yeah, ain't no skips.
Speaker 3:No skips. And then Stevie Wonder, the best songwriter of all time probably.
Speaker 1:So you say he's your best songwriter ever, stevie. Wonder, for sure. Okay, okay, okay, okay, I mean, yeah, I mean, I'm not going to say you're retarded. It's ridiculous. Yeah, it's like ridiculous. And give me three songs that changed your life.
Speaker 3:Man. Now this is tough. Three songs that changed my life, sheesh man. Okay, I think I said this before. Stevie Wonder Rock your Love. I love that song. I just remember being outside when when uh, with n-o-r-e nori stands for now you're on the run eating outside. When that came out, I was crazy. That was a moment. It's so many songs, that many. Yeah, I was winnie houston. I will always love you. That song always, always touched me when I heard it from the beginning. Yeah, I would say those three.
Speaker 1:Okay, okay, those are three good ones, and varied. You know what I'm saying?
Speaker 3:Rocket Love, Nori and Whitney, I listen to everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I do the same. I don't try to lock into one particular genre. For me it's whoever's dope In whatever genre. Genre it is like I mean nirvana was super dope and obviously stevie's super dope, and like if you, if you can master what you're doing, I want to hear it. Yeah, you know saying doesn't have to be only r&b or only rap or whatever. Totally. One more thing, one more question, and then we're gonna wrap it. Um, is there a concert, a show that you went to that, I don't know, changed your life? That might be kind of strong, but that you kind of just stuck in your brain like you know something?
Speaker 3:Yeah for sure, it's two. So the first ever concert I went to was Criss Cross, okay, and we was in there with our clothes on backwards that one for sure. And then I was there the night at Madison Square Garden with Jay-Z, where R Kelly didn't come out.
Speaker 1:I was there too.
Speaker 3:That was insane.
Speaker 1:Insane. Insane Because, again, I'm at Jive at that time and so we all like what the fuck is going on. And then the lights are dark and nobody knows what's happening. And then everybody starts coming out all the other artists.
Speaker 3:Yeah, all the other artists. And then everybody starts coming out all the other artists, yeah, all the other artists.
Speaker 1:That night was insane, that was wild man?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I was in college at that time, that was crazy.
Speaker 1:That was a moment. That was a moment. So right now you're doing your Easy Money thing full time. You're working with Leon. What are your visions for Easy Money?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so we in the process of doing a new deal. It's almost done, so we'll be announcing that soon. But yeah, we just want to sign the best talent with our new partner and just grow it and continue to grow. Leon he's, I feel like he's going to have one of those careers like a weekend, like just somebody of that stature, because he's 10, 20 years.
Speaker 1:10, 20 year career.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he could perform. He performs as good as he sings, as good as he writes, as good as he produces. So, yeah, he's, he's that good, he's going to be that big but, yeah, just continuing to grow out our brand and, you know, having us be one of the staples, the new bad boy, the new Rockefeller, the new, you know, whatever it may be, we want to be in those conversations.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I'm proud of you, man, appreciate it. Thank you for coming through and showing love and telling the people your story. I think they're going to enjoy this one. This is a good show, I appreciate it. Take bits and shit. You know some fun times. You know what I'm saying For sure. I remember those meetings we were in together at Atlantic, you know.
Speaker 3:Insane.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll talk about that more later, yo, I really appreciate it, sean. Thank you for coming on, man, and eventually I would love to get you know Leon and Ty on here as well to talk about their craft and all that. You know, we're working out later on, but I appreciate everything, man, thank you. Thank you, man. Yes, sir, you can catch mixed and mastered on apple podcast, spotify, iheart or wherever you get your podcasts. Hit that follow button, leave a review and tell a friend I'm your host, jeffrey sledge. Mixed and mastered is produced and distributed by merrick studios.
